8pm clapping

[Tom Joad]

“But I’ll still vote for a party that cheers not giving nhs workers a pay rise”

Correct. 

A trite, hollow gesture.

That says a lot about the condition of the Labour Party at the last election.

Indeed but it also says a lot about many of our electorate Get Stupid Done

That's a bit like the England cricket team blaming the Barmy Army when they lose. One afternoon walking around a few traditional Labour voting areas would have been enough to notice Corbyn was unelectable. I voted Labour, albeit safe with the knowledge I wouldn't be inflicting him on the country, but merely as a feeble protest vote. Those Momentum types need to have a good look at themselves and what they actually achieved.

[JOK]

All the bluster and misdirection doesn’t hide the fact at the time of voting Tory ministers bar one voted against public sector workers getting a pay rise. For whatever reason they were cheering and braying like fucking farm yard animals which was crass at best given they were voting on people’s incomes. What happened next is irrelevant to their behaviour that day and quite rightly they and those that voted for them subsequently are being called out as hypocrites as they showed absolutely no respect to those public sector workers, many of whom before Covid 19 were described by the same people as ‘low skilled’, and are now lauded as heroes and ‘key workers.’

You and others are indulging in the misdirection, highlighting the usual behaviour of our moronic MPs and inferring it was a one off occurrence for one specific thing. Here are just a couple of exemplars to show it is common behaviour. 

https://youtu.be/i3YFB_roWn0.  @ 3h 33’

https://youtu.be/XJg6FiIeofA.  @7’ 25

Which Tory Minister voted aye? According to Hansard no Conservative
MP, let alone a minister, voted for the amendment but four Tory MPs abstained. Also again, they were not voting to “stop public workers getting a pay rise”! Correcting your inaccuracies, whether they be through malevolence or tardiness, is not “bluster or misdirection.
And of course it is not irrelevant what they did just months later, unless they had all been on a stroll towards Damascus. Do you honestly believe that hundreds of MPs and millions of their “supporters” are callous, heartless and unfeeling individuals, indifferent to the plight and wellbeing of others? 
You like to give the impression that you are politically savvy and have displayed in this thread your belief that you know better than a goodly majority of voters; (nice bit of hubris here “... it says a lot about many of our electorate.“ It’s all very well constantly criticising but you never offer better alternatives so, I ask you again, which set of politicians ( not withstanding we could have had a ‘loose’ National Government for the duration) would be handling this extreme situation better ? And for post crisis, the country. 
To answer another of your posts. 
You seem continually confused about and often conflate your two pet fixations Conservatives and Brexit. Vast swathes of Labour voters voted to leave the E.U. The majority of Tory MPs were remainers. How does voting for one equate with support for the other? Just to be clear, were many of the electorate in the ‘Red Wall’ thick when they voted for Brexit or were they dim when they used to vote for Labour? 

Talking of farm animals, I’m fast believing your Latin monicker is so, so apt. By the way. Well done.

[Derek Hardballs]

I believe that austerity was both ideological and disproportionately targeted at the most vulnerable. Whilst multi-billion pound organisations were and still are allowed to avoid tax.

I believe that thousands of people if not more have been convinced by very rich and powerful individuals and corporations to vote against their best interests. Unless of course those best interests were served by losing Police, NHS staff, Brexit etc.

I believe that until this crisis the term ‘low skilled’ was used for our now ‘heroic’ key workers in the NHS and care sector. I believe that behaving crassly when defeating a bill to give those same people a pay rise is pertinent to what they truly believe about public services and heck some of them have even written / co-authored shoddy books / pamphlets about their wish to get rid of the NHS and reduce the public sector further. One of them is the same person who is now using the word heroic to describe them and the other is the Home Secretary who is sorry they feel they don’t have enough PPE.

As for who could do better? It’s rather silly hypothetical question that football fans use when they are running out of excuses for the shit form their team is on when defending a manager they like.

For someone who won’t admit who he voted for you sure do a lot of defending of this current incarnation of the Conservative government.

[Squid]

I believe that austerity was both ideological and disproportionately targeted at the most vulnerable. Whilst multi-billion pound organisations were and still are allowed to avoid tax.

I believe that thousands of people if not more have been convinced by very rich and powerful individuals and corporations to vote against their best interests. Unless of course those best interests were served by losing Police, NHS staff, Brexit etc.

I believe that until this crisis the term ‘low skilled’ was used for our now ‘heroic’ key workers in the NHS and care sector. I believe that behaving crassly when defeating a bill to give those same people a pay rise is pertinent to what they truly believe about public services and heck some of them have even written / co-authored shoddy books / pamphlets about their wish to get rid of the NHS and reduce the public sector further. One of them is the same person who is now using the word heroic to describe them and the other is the Home Secretary who is sorry they feel they don’t have enough PPE.

As for who could do better? It’s rather silly hypothetical question that football fans use when they are running out of excuses for the shit form their team is on when defending a manager they like.

For someone who won’t admit who he voted for you sure do a lot of defending of this current incarnation of the Conservative government.

Who could do better is not a hypothetical question. It's the only question, the one that is asked at every election.

We've had three general elections and three times, despite the awfulness of the Conservative government, the public has still voted for them, because they did not trust that Labour front bench in government.

That is a colossal and shameful failure on the part of the Labour Party. By being wilfully unelectable, they have failed the people who needed them most and I blame them as much as the Tories.

[TETLEY74]

I believe that austerity was both ideological and disproportionately targeted at the most vulnerable. Whilst multi-billion pound organisations were and still are allowed to avoid tax.

I believe that thousands of people if not more have been convinced by very rich and powerful individuals and corporations to vote against their best interests. Unless of course those best interests were served by losing Police, NHS staff, Brexit etc.

I believe that until this crisis the term ‘low skilled’ was used for our now ‘heroic’ key workers in the NHS and care sector. I believe that behaving crassly when defeating a bill to give those same people a pay rise is pertinent to what they truly believe about public services and heck some of them have even written / co-authored shoddy books / pamphlets about their wish to get rid of the NHS and reduce the public sector further. One of them is the same person who is now using the word heroic to describe them and the other is the Home Secretary who is sorry they feel they don’t have enough PPE.

As for who could do better? It’s rather silly hypothetical question that football fans use when they are running out of excuses for the shit form their team is on when defending a manager they like.

For someone who won’t admit who he voted for you sure do a lot of defending of this current incarnation of the Conservative government.

Who could do better is not a hypothetical question. It's the only question, the one that is asked at every election.

We've had three general elections and three times, despite the awfulness of the Conservative government, the public has still voted for them, because they did not trust that Labour front bench in government.

That is a colossal and shameful failure on the part of the Labour Party. By being wilfully unelectable, they have failed the people who needed them most and I blame them as much as the Tories.

Perfectly put mon.

[Derek Hardballs]

I believe that austerity was both ideological and disproportionately targeted at the most vulnerable. Whilst multi-billion pound organisations were and still are allowed to avoid tax.

I believe that thousands of people if not more have been convinced by very rich and powerful individuals and corporations to vote against their best interests. Unless of course those best interests were served by losing Police, NHS staff, Brexit etc.

I believe that until this crisis the term ‘low skilled’ was used for our now ‘heroic’ key workers in the NHS and care sector. I believe that behaving crassly when defeating a bill to give those same people a pay rise is pertinent to what they truly believe about public services and heck some of them have even written / co-authored shoddy books / pamphlets about their wish to get rid of the NHS and reduce the public sector further. One of them is the same person who is now using the word heroic to describe them and the other is the Home Secretary who is sorry they feel they don’t have enough PPE.

As for who could do better? It’s rather silly hypothetical question that football fans use when they are running out of excuses for the shit form their team is on when defending a manager they like.

For someone who won’t admit who he voted for you sure do a lot of defending of this current incarnation of the Conservative government.

Who could do better is not a hypothetical question. It's the only question, the one that is asked at every election.

We've had three general elections and three times, despite the awfulness of the Conservative government, the public has still voted for them, because they did not trust that Labour front bench in government.

That is a colossal and shameful failure on the part of the Labour Party. By being wilfully unelectable, they have failed the people who needed them most and I blame them as much as the Tories.

I don’t disagree that Labour have been appalling in opposition for years. That said it’s still hypothetical whether they would have done any better or worse. East Enders is popular it’s still fugging dreadful.

[Squid]

I believe that austerity was both ideological and disproportionately targeted at the most vulnerable. Whilst multi-billion pound organisations were and still are allowed to avoid tax.

I believe that thousands of people if not more have been convinced by very rich and powerful individuals and corporations to vote against their best interests. Unless of course those best interests were served by losing Police, NHS staff, Brexit etc.

I believe that until this crisis the term ‘low skilled’ was used for our now ‘heroic’ key workers in the NHS and care sector. I believe that behaving crassly when defeating a bill to give those same people a pay rise is pertinent to what they truly believe about public services and heck some of them have even written / co-authored shoddy books / pamphlets about their wish to get rid of the NHS and reduce the public sector further. One of them is the same person who is now using the word heroic to describe them and the other is the Home Secretary who is sorry they feel they don’t have enough PPE.

As for who could do better? It’s rather silly hypothetical question that football fans use when they are running out of excuses for the shit form their team is on when defending a manager they like.

For someone who won’t admit who he voted for you sure do a lot of defending of this current incarnation of the Conservative government.

Who could do better is not a hypothetical question. It's the only question, the one that is asked at every election.

We've had three general elections and three times, despite the awfulness of the Conservative government, the public has still voted for them, because they did not trust that Labour front bench in government.

That is a colossal and shameful failure on the part of the Labour Party. By being wilfully unelectable, they have failed the people who needed them most and I blame them as much as the Tories.

I don’t disagree that Labour have been appalling in opposition for years. That said it’s still hypothetical whether they would have done any better or worse. East Enders is popular it’s still fugging dreadful.

The thought of a Tankie like Milne being anywhere near any position of authority fills me with dread. Between two poor options, people will choose the familiar.

[Tom Joad]

I believe that austerity was both ideological and disproportionately targeted at the most vulnerable. Whilst multi-billion pound organisations were and still are allowed to avoid tax.

I believe that thousands of people if not more have been convinced by very rich and powerful individuals and corporations to vote against their best interests. Unless of course those best interests were served by losing Police, NHS staff, Brexit etc.

I believe that until this crisis the term ‘low skilled’ was used for our now ‘heroic’ key workers in the NHS and care sector. I believe that behaving crassly when defeating a bill to give those same people a pay rise is pertinent to what they truly believe about public services and heck some of them have even written / co-authored shoddy books / pamphlets about their wish to get rid of the NHS and reduce the public sector further. One of them is the same person who is now using the word heroic to describe them and the other is the Home Secretary who is sorry they feel they don’t have enough PPE.

As for who could do better? It’s rather silly hypothetical question that football fans use when they are running out of excuses for the shit form their team is on when defending a manager they like.

For someone who won’t admit who he voted for you sure do a lot of defending of this current incarnation of the Conservative government.

Who could do better is not a hypothetical question. It's the only question, the one that is asked at every election.

We've had three general elections and three times, despite the awfulness of the Conservative government, the public has still voted for them, because they did not trust that Labour front bench in government.

That is a colossal and shameful failure on the part of the Labour Party. By being wilfully unelectable, they have failed the people who needed them most and I blame them as much as the Tories.

This, absolutely.
Without any credible opposition, any government can have a free hit.

[billybassett]

I believe that austerity was both ideological and disproportionately targeted at the most vulnerable. Whilst multi-billion pound organisations were and still are allowed to avoid tax.

I believe that thousands of people if not more have been convinced by very rich and powerful individuals and corporations to vote against their best interests. Unless of course those best interests were served by losing Police, NHS staff, Brexit etc.

I believe that until this crisis the term ‘low skilled’ was used for our now ‘heroic’ key workers in the NHS and care sector. I believe that behaving crassly when defeating a bill to give those same people a pay rise is pertinent to what they truly believe about public services and heck some of them have even written / co-authored shoddy books / pamphlets about their wish to get rid of the NHS and reduce the public sector further. One of them is the same person who is now using the word heroic to describe them and the other is the Home Secretary who is sorry they feel they don’t have enough PPE.

As for who could do better? It’s rather silly hypothetical question that football fans use when they are running out of excuses for the shit form their team is on when defending a manager they like.

For someone who won’t admit who he voted for you sure do a lot of defending of this current incarnation of the Conservative government.

Who could do better is not a hypothetical question. It's the only question, the one that is asked at every election.

We've had three general elections and three times, despite the awfulness of the Conservative government, the public has still voted for them, because they did not trust that Labour front bench in government.

That is a colossal and shameful failure on the part of the Labour Party. By being wilfully unelectable, they have failed the people who needed them most and I blame them as much as the Tories.

This, absolutely.
Without any credible opposition, any government can have a free hit.

Exactly. All those pot bangers in Momentum spouting their ideological hyperbole in a room with nobody listening but themselves. Well done all of you.

Add this to the sad fact that people are generally stupid, that the media is basically a right wing drum, and big business sways all....

[TETLEY74]

I believe that austerity was both ideological and disproportionately targeted at the most vulnerable. Whilst multi-billion pound organisations were and still are allowed to avoid tax.

I believe that thousands of people if not more have been convinced by very rich and powerful individuals and corporations to vote against their best interests. Unless of course those best interests were served by losing Police, NHS staff, Brexit etc.

I believe that until this crisis the term ‘low skilled’ was used for our now ‘heroic’ key workers in the NHS and care sector. I believe that behaving crassly when defeating a bill to give those same people a pay rise is pertinent to what they truly believe about public services and heck some of them have even written / co-authored shoddy books / pamphlets about their wish to get rid of the NHS and reduce the public sector further. One of them is the same person who is now using the word heroic to describe them and the other is the Home Secretary who is sorry they feel they don’t have enough PPE.

As for who could do better? It’s rather silly hypothetical question that football fans use when they are running out of excuses for the shit form their team is on when defending a manager they like.

For someone who won’t admit who he voted for you sure do a lot of defending of this current incarnation of the Conservative government.

Who could do better is not a hypothetical question. It's the only question, the one that is asked at every election.

We've had three general elections and three times, despite the awfulness of the Conservative government, the public has still voted for them, because they did not trust that Labour front bench in government.

That is a colossal and shameful failure on the part of the Labour Party. By being wilfully unelectable, they have failed the people who needed them most and I blame them as much as the Tories.

This, absolutely.
Without any credible opposition, any government can have a free hit.

Exactly. All those pot bangers in Momentum spouting their ideological hyperbole in a room with nobody listening but themselves. Well done all of you.

Add this to the sad fact that people are generally stupid, that the media is basically a right wing drum, and big business sways all....

Yep momentum have inflicted more damage and misery on the labour party in the last 10+ years than the tories could ever have hoped to do, and I have no political allengence to any party at all as I think they're all a bunch of lying twofaced cheating dishonest selfish twats the lot of them, although I conceed there are a few decent politicians who try to do the right thing unfortunately there are no where near enough of them in any party.